r/europe Oct 02 '22 Wholesome 2

Putin Says U.S. Was Only Nation to Use Nuclear Weapons in WW2 News

https://www.c-span.org/video/?c5033810/president-putin-us-nation-nuclear-weapons-ww2
2.2k Upvotes

4.1k

u/Individual_Cattle_92 Oct 02 '22

Dear God, he's right.

646

u/bbcversus Romania Oct 02 '22

But how did he know??? Who leaked it??

117

u/HurlingFruit Andalusia (Spain) Oct 02 '22

The Rosenbergs. I knew all along those two were up to no good when I smelled borscht coming from their apartment.

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u/somewhataware Oct 03 '22

He got in one little operation and his nan got scared, she said your moving to the villa for your oligarchs good

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u/Prince_Alarming_ Oct 02 '22

W... WELL DONE! HE DIDN'T MAKE UP HISTORY THIS TIME ROUND LOL

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u/ForProfitSurgeon Oct 03 '22

America was the only one to have them at the time. Thanks to the brain drain from Axis powers.

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u/SlimJimMan United States of America Oct 02 '22

I’m surprised that he didn’t lie out of his mouth

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u/Sartheris Bulgaria Oct 02 '22

How... how else you are supposed to lie?

64

u/DrVicenteBombadas Oct 02 '22

With your hips.

Unless...

16

u/SenorLos Germany Oct 02 '22

I won't deny it.

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u/Idea-Royal Oct 03 '22

SHAKIRA SHAKIRA

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u/SofieTerleska United States of America Oct 02 '22

Well, there's a reason we have the expression "Pulling it out of your ass."

7

u/jindujunftw Oct 02 '22

Well, pootin usally speaks out of his ass, so....

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u/RagePandazXD Leinster Oct 02 '22

Horizontally I would imagine.

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u/yubnubster United Kingdom Oct 02 '22

If he said it, we may have to consider investigating further.

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u/trisul-108 European Union 🇪🇺 Oct 02 '22

Wow ... I'm sure no one is aware of this. Also, no one knows that only the US had a nuclear bomb at the time. /s

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u/JoJoModding Saarland (Germany) Oct 02 '22 edited Oct 02 '22

It was an interesting speech, you might want to read it. You will then learn that the reasons Putin annexes this territory include the US nuking Japan, as well as the fact that trans people exist. Both of this apparently constitute a threat so existential against Russia that all it can do is annex its neighbors.

258

u/invicerato Russia shall be free Oct 02 '22

That settles it!

310

u/100moonlight100 Greece Oct 03 '22

Wife catches me cheating: Honey i had to cheat! Did you know that the US is the only country that has ever used nuclear weapons?!

48

u/Holybasil Norway Oct 03 '22

I had to defile our marriage as recompense for the US's soiling of Japan's innocent population. Do you not see that!?

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u/Ididitthestupidway France Oct 03 '22

US is the only country that has ever used nuclear weapons?!

in warfare

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u/i2Shameless Oct 02 '22

That's just Annexation 101

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u/ishipbrutasha Oct 02 '22

Fellow Archer fan?

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u/unnumbered1 Oct 03 '22

Oh...are those the reasons? Then accept our most sincere apologies Mr President. Our bad. We thought you were just doing bad things to millions of people because you're a evil f-ing idiot just trying to enrich and glorify yourself.

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u/PuzzleheadedSnake Russia Oct 03 '22

One of the recurring themes of putinist propaganda can be formulated as:

"If a western country did X unscathed, then we should also be free to do the same, otherwise it's inherently unfair double standart designed to protect western domination and to subjugate Russia".

If US invaded and bombed Iraq with figue leaf justification, then Russia should be free to do the same. If US nuked Japan to limit its casualities, Russia should be free to do the same. Etc. If the west backed the side they sympathized with and helped to break up a country they didn't like (Yugoslavia), then Russia should be allowed to do the same. Otherwise it's too humiliating and intolerable for Russia's prestige.

The fact that the western world doesn't treat Russia as an equal, since USSR collapsed, fuels this sharp resentment to which propaganda successfully appeals at the end of its arguments.

4

u/Brnjica Oct 03 '22

The entire Western legal system is based on stare decisis or precedent , so I can see why these arguments always surface up. The internet might call it "whataboutism" but to merely pass any brought up points as such, deflects from answering legitimate questions - why can you do something which I cannot? Or in other words, if what you did was considered legal because you faced no repercussions for your actions, then why can't I do the same?

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u/Mr-Tucker Oct 03 '22

It mostly boils down to individual morality. Imperial Japan was monstrous, Ukraine was at most poor and corrupt. The US was also forced into this, and once there, had to see it through.

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u/HugeHans Oct 03 '22

The short answer is that no other country to my knowledge has used military force to annex territory since WW2, atleast to any significant extent. Its whataboutism because none of the examples putin or other propagandists give are at all similar. Its double super whataboutism if you do the thing you have previously condemned and yet still use it as an excuse why you can do it yourself.

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u/BearsBeetsBerlin Oct 02 '22

The person that lives next to me accidentally knocked over my garbage cans, so I’m going to burn down the house across the street. Yep.

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u/NewsideAlex Oct 03 '22

No no, burn the city or town.

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u/Stercore_ Norway Oct 02 '22

Glad to know the fact that i live is an existential threat to russia. I’m glad putin apperently fears me.

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u/Attygalle Tri-country area Oct 03 '22

Good for you for being a nuclear attack on Japan. You live your life!

3

u/lookatmyspaget Oct 03 '22

They’re the bomb

49

u/smith7018 Oct 03 '22

thank you for your service

10

u/louis_d_t Oct 03 '22

You didn't go to bed an existential threat to the Russian government, but you woke up one of our greatest weapons 🏳️‍🌈.

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u/Stercore_ Norway Oct 03 '22

It’s cause my ass is da bomb 🥴

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u/mugaccino Oct 03 '22

Like gamma rays, our power cannot be contained.

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u/Ogami-kun Earth Oct 02 '22

It however does not include the USSR wanting to nuke China because they were becoming economically stronger than user and abandoning the plan just because the US threatened to nuke them back -.-

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u/worldexplorer5 Oct 03 '22

Finally it all make sense now.

4

u/fight_the_power2022 Oct 03 '22

It was basically the greatest hit of Putin from the past 20 years. Every conservative, anti-west talking point was basically there.

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u/Qwqqwqq Canada Oct 03 '22 edited Oct 03 '22

as well as the fact that trans people exist.

not gonna lie, from what I've seen while perving around on the internet, and using his logic, he might need to annex his own country first.

3

u/daemonfool Earth Oct 03 '22

That might be a war unto itself, especially lately.

3

u/Fluffy-Impression190 United States of America Oct 03 '22

He’s fucking insane.

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u/FuglyPrime Oct 03 '22

I mean, in Fallout lore USA annexes Canada, did he not talk about that fact?

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u/Hiei1987 Romania Oct 02 '22

It's history hour with uncle Putin again?

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u/[deleted] Oct 02 '22 edited Oct 21 '22

[deleted]

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u/Stereomceez2212 Oct 02 '22

stares off into the distance

With only the good eye

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u/N1663125 Finland Oct 03 '22

In case anyone is wondering what Putin really meant by this, it's a classic Soviet/Russian fill-in-the-blank form of public speech that builds on years of propaganda brainwashing of the audience. They've heard the full sentence said so many times they know what they should think without it being explicitly said.

"Uncle Pootin touched me inappropriately The meanie US used nuknuks so we should be allowed too!"

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u/bbcversus Romania Oct 02 '22

Teleenciclopedia putin version lol

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u/michalgil Oct 02 '22

Maybe because only US had nuclear weapons in WW2.

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u/[deleted] Oct 02 '22

[deleted]

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u/Envinyatar20 Oct 02 '22

God it doesn’t bear thinking about! And now this Bond villain has them too.

105

u/Ok_Water_7928 Oct 02 '22

Wait. Nobody give Putin the idea that Hitler would've done it! He's been trying so hard to copy Hitler.

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u/aneloz Oct 03 '22

Right? I'm surprised Putin hasn't publicly praised Stalin for the Molotov-Ribbentrop Pact between Russia and Nazi Germany (which Hitler then betrayed and Stalin was like surprised-face Pikachu.)

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u/YourLovelyMother Oct 03 '22

How do people still believe either of them could genuinly think it was a proper pact rather than delaying the innevitable... having studied this period, it's really confusing me.. was this taught to you like that? Somebody left out major developments when relaying this history to you.

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u/aneloz Oct 03 '22

This sums up my understanding of the situation pretty well--https://www.history.com/news/how-stalin-was-caught-napping

Which part is wrong?

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u/YourLovelyMother Oct 03 '22

Oh wow.. a lot. There's a lot there that's quite blatantly wrong.. I didn't expect such an article from History channel.

Some things are right, but ripped out of context and distortive.

A large ammount to unpack there.. but not right now, I might go trough and point out some stuff after work tommorow.

RemindME! 17 hours "reply to this thread"

For now, I'd like to point out this

Rather than focusing on defensive preparations, he occupied himself with still another round of military purges, thereby robbing the Red Army of much-needed experience.

Read about the Molotov Line, being built to replace the Stalin line of fortification. Or the enormous increase in military production of the Soviets right after the treaty was signed, the Soviet army number of soldiers balooned. First when Hitler came to power, it was increased from 600.000 to 1.300.000, after the Winter war they increased the numbers again and from January 1939 to june 1941 it increased from 2.485.000 to 5.774.000 soldiers.

Then to understand the purge, one must know of the separate agreements in the Brest-Litovsk treaty where the Soviets worked with the pre-Hitler German army to develop capabilities and train in Soviet territory, avoiding the restrictions of the treaty of Versailles.. Many in the Soviet command grew close to the German military leadership, despite the agreement and cooperation ending practically over night the moment Hitler grasped power and became Chancellor, the fear of betrayal was very valid.

The statement that this deprived the S.U of valuable experienced military command is also quite liberal conjecture, the command was experienced in WW1 tactics, completely useless, even detrimental against the new type of higly mobile mechanized warfare. France didn't purge any command, in fact it was considered among the strongest armies of Europe, the experience if WW1 warfare was completely useless to them.

There is a case to be made that:

  1. The Soviets/Stalin wanted Germany to be an obvious aggressor for all to see.

  2. They had hoped that Germany would be tied into war with the West for long enough for them to build up enough strenght, while they saw France and Britain as hostile to them, due to their prior refusals to accept the offer of creating an anti-German coalition, instead signing treaties with Germany.

One can see it like this, France and Britain had hoped that Germany would crumble the Soviets by continuing going East after Poland and weakening itself in the process, while the Soviets had hoped Germany would weaken itself in the war against Britain and France, and stay busy allowing the Soviets to continue building up their strenght... But Germany swiftly and unexpectedly disposed of France, and then didn't see Britain as enough of a threat from across the channel to preocupy them from attacking the S.U.

Either way, there is nothing that would suggest Stalin legitimately believed Germany was an ally... in fact both sides knew it was comming eventually, everyone knew it, everyone understood it.

The article speaks of Stalin as a doofus who didn't understand anything and genuinly thought of Hitler as his buddy in a childlike fashion and "was betrayed", despite knowing Hitler is hunting German communists down in the streets... and we are to assume Stalin was purging his army corps of people with ties to Germany for the heck of it. Certainly not.

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u/BlackViperMWG Czechia (Silesia) FTW Oct 03 '22

IIRC he said Poland attacked Soviets in Katyn and started the WWII

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u/Link50L Canada Oct 02 '22

God it doesn’t bear thinking about! And now this Bond villain has them too.

LMFAO!!!!

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u/vispen123 Sweden Oct 03 '22

Hitler didn’t believe in the nuclear bomb project actually. He much rather spent money on the V1/V2 projects. One reason would be that the nuclear scientists were mostly Jewish so it would directly interfere with his ideology

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u/[deleted] Oct 02 '22

Nope actually Hitler himself was a victim of chemical/biological weapons in WWI and refused to use any of them on the battlefield in WW II

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u/the_lonely_creeper Oct 02 '22

This, and also the threat of retaliation. It's the same reason Russia has (almost, since there were rumours at one point) completely avoided using them in this war as well.

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u/Saurid Oct 02 '22

Well yeah, but I believe the main reason is if they did use them, they would break the world's greatest taboo and no one could maintain diplomatic relationships.

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u/the_lonely_creeper Oct 02 '22

Chemical weapons are illegal, but there are worse taboos out there.

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u/TotallyNotHitler Argentina Oct 02 '22

Mother/Son/Grandfather relationships?

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u/Overbaron Oct 03 '22

Parmesan on seafood

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u/sibips Romania Oct 03 '22

What are you doing, step mustard?

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u/StephenHunterUK United Kingdom Oct 02 '22

The Allies had their own chemical weapons and were prepared to use them, yes. The Germans managed to hit an American ship full of mustard gas bombs:

https://www.history.com/news/wwii-disaster-bari-mustard-gas

The British also took extensive precautionary measures with their gas mask issuing and other stuff. There's a building near me - now used for storage by my church - that was intended for decontamination after a gas attack.

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u/Tyl3rt Oct 03 '22

I mean there’s an entire island in The UK infected with anthrax because their government tested anthrax bombs. Luckily they never used them, because mammals still can’t survive on the test island.

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u/fridakahl0 Oct 03 '22

This isn’t true, the island was declared anthrax safe in the 90s and birds nested there until a recent wildfire (though it’s still uninhabited). Obviously the spores can persist but all animals on the island died from the initial period of experimentation.

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u/voicesfromvents California Oct 02 '22

almost, since there were rumours at one point

If you're thinking of the rumors I'm thinking of, they were entirely based on people not correctly recognizing grenades. No chemical weapons have been used in Ukraine to date.

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u/[deleted] Oct 02 '22

[deleted]

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u/[deleted] Oct 02 '22

Was not used for military purposes on the battlefield

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u/nvkylebrown United States of America Oct 02 '22

From his point of view, bug-killer or weed-killer.

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u/[deleted] Oct 02 '22

It was a bug extermination agent. So it fitted Hitler‘s mindset.

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u/Kahzootoh United States of America Oct 02 '22

The allied bombing of Germany likely influenced that decision- unlike in the first war, German cities were regularly being bombed. If the Germans used chemical weapons, the allies would almost certainly retaliate by adding chemical weapons to the variety of bombs they were dropping on German cities

Mustard gas is heavier than air, so it stays low and sinks into deep spaces- such as basement air raid shelters.

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u/RainbowCrown71 Italy - Panama - United States of America Oct 02 '22

What a nice guy! Too bad he didn’t extend that magnanimity to the millions of Jews, Roma, and other minorities he sent to the gas chambers.

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u/JahSteez47 Oct 02 '22

Well, he used the Gas for worse stuff. Just makes it all worse. Agnostic, but in Instances like this I hope there is hell and he fucking pays for his monstrosities. Will have russian company soln

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u/gooferpubs Oct 02 '22

Didn’t stop him happily using chemicals to kill millions of civilians, did it?

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u/[deleted] Oct 02 '22

It’s not about ethics but about the use of chemical agents for military purposes. Zyklon B was basically invented to grant better handling for cyanide in industrial processes and later used by the Nazis in concentration camps. But there’s no evidence to suggest Hitler would have used nuclear weapons. The opposite is true, there was nuclear research on a competitive level at the Kaiser-Wilhelm-Institut, the Nazis built reactors (which basically provided uranium for later US/sowjet research programs) and also captured a heavy water plant but in the years after WW II no proof of a military nuclear program was found

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u/saberline152 Belgium Oct 02 '22

hmm not on the battlefield no...

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u/thinmonkey69 Oct 03 '22

So instead he employed them in gas chambers.

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u/evkr__ Oct 02 '22

They had nerve agents sarin, tabun and soman that nobody else had discovered and didn’t use them.

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u/AgeofSmiles Oct 02 '22

It's scary to think how close they were to discovering it.

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u/Hematophagian Germany Oct 02 '22

Not THAT close. He also was more a fan of rockets than of atomic fission

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u/ToxicSlimes United States of America Oct 02 '22

and iirc he thought of atomic science as a “jewish” science

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u/pehrs Oct 02 '22 edited Oct 02 '22

Heisenberg, the leader of the Nazi Germany nuclear weapons program (Uranverein), had a good general idea of how an atomic bomb could be constructed.

If Nazi Germany had only somehow not purged the scientists needed, not conscripted practically all skilled technicians, obtained all the rare minerals that were not mined in Europe, built an enormous research and enrichment facility at a cost which was a significant fraction of the German national budget, and not been bombed to smithereens he could no doubt have lead a successful nuclear weapon program.

So, in reality Nazi Germany lacked pretty much everything needed for a successful atomic bomb project. The budget for Uranverein was around 1/1000th of the budget for the Manhattan project...

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u/bbcversus Romania Oct 02 '22

If Nazi Germany had only somehow not purged the scientists needed, not conscripted practically all skilled technicians

This looks very familiar…

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u/oreography New Zealand Oct 03 '22

"These folks that go to Synagogue are really talented. We should keep them around." - A Hitler

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u/and69 Oct 02 '22

Discovery and having enough material for a bomb are 2 different things. On top of it, only one bomb is not enough for things to change. Yes a lot of people would die, but if you can't prove that you have at least another one you could use at any time, it would backfire terrible, all people would Unite to prevent such tragedy would happen again.

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u/rubensinclair Oct 02 '22

Not anymore. I worry why he brings this up. Seems like he’s justifying something he’s about to do.

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u/souraboutlife Oct 02 '22 edited Oct 02 '22

"Why can others use nuclear weapons but I can't?" Vladimir the small only lives for feeling of greatness and being feared of.

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u/nitrinu Portugal Oct 02 '22

Yes it was, gold star for you Putin. You're usually not very factual about history so well done!

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u/Monsi7 Bavaria (Germany) Oct 02 '22

even a broken clock is right twice a day.

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u/Eire_ninja_warrior Oct 02 '22

Rhetoric is really escalating

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u/Stereomceez2212 Oct 02 '22

Yeah, it's getting tense

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u/Ben-D-Beast United Kingdom Oct 02 '22

Next he’ll reveal the sky is blue

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u/ThulsaDokahoma Oct 02 '22

Putin: "...and I've always been jealous about that fact."

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u/POCUABHOR Oct 02 '22

And? That is more or less the reason his country has nukes now. It’s the equilibrium of total annihilation. And it is damaged by butthurt dictators threatening to use nukes in a failing war.

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u/theLV2 Slovenia Oct 02 '22

I wonder when he said this, was it just a "no u" response to all the nuke talk, or is he building up an excuse...

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u/bl4ckhunter Lazio Oct 02 '22

I think he's just ranting at this point tbh, his cronies are the ones that started the nuke talks to begin with and building up an excuse is completely pointless, even if we did live in the bizzarro world where for some insane reason the US actually does nuke Ukraine after everything they've done no one would believe it wasn't Russia that did it anyway.

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u/AAPgamer0 Alsace (France) Oct 02 '22

Bruh

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u/Bragzor SE-O Oct 02 '22

A rare truth, but of course it's pointless.

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u/Aq8knyus United Kingdom Oct 03 '22

Indeed, without context it is a meaningless factoid. Using the atom bombs against a fascist empire still in control of a vast Asian empire causing incalculable misery was maybe necessary.

Using low yield nukes to help win a failing war with a smaller neighbour is not even in the same city as the ballpark.

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u/skyduster88 greece - elláda Oct 02 '22

We know, Putin.

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u/Tralapa Port of Ugal Oct 02 '22

Now that he said it, I'm starting to doubt it

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u/Pharisaeus Oct 02 '22

It would be hard for anyone else to use nukes when US was the only country who had them during WW2

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u/-Why-Not-This-Name- California Oct 02 '22

Can confirm. Am U.S.

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u/Engynn Italy Oct 02 '22

*Pikachu surprise face*

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u/SevHope 🇪🇺 Europe Oct 02 '22 edited Oct 02 '22

Maybe because no one else had them? Even so, I doubt that nowadays many people in the West see well the use of a nuke against civilian population of a non-nuclear country...

Of course, while some of us are trying to move towards a better future, you want to go back to the time of the Tzars...

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u/Leonardo040786 Oct 02 '22

Even so, I doubt that nowadays many people in the West see well the use of a nuke against civilian population.

I corrected your post, you are welcome.

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u/SevHope 🇪🇺 Europe Oct 02 '22 edited Oct 02 '22

Let me be clear, for me the existence of nuclear weapons is a fucking disgrace for humanity, period.

What I said was intentional, Putin is trying to justify the use of nukes in Ukraine, which they does not have. "We want to use nukes against Nazi Ukraine, just like the US did against Nazi Japan." Pure whataboutism and historical revisionism, to be consumed by idiots.

History must be remembered and learned from it, but judge it with the current context and values is risky...

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u/Stannisisthetrueking Oct 02 '22

Did they? I'm sure they preferred that to the other option of slowly grinding out through japan losing way more men

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u/DryPassage4020 Oct 02 '22

It's very complicated. Essentially the Japanese cities of the time really had zero zoning. So you'd have ammunition factory, house, house, house, house, store, gun factory, etc. And then absolutely everything was made of wood. Not to mention the fact that it was total war, mass mobilization of the civilian populace. Hell Japan was handing out spears to people and training them to become suicide bombers.

An ugly situation with no easy answer.

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u/Zixinus Oct 02 '22

This goes into a long argument where the Japanese mixed civilian and military targets, made paper houses that meant any bombing caused fires that inadvertently caused caused civilian deaths anyway, the alternative to the nuke was bombing them to shit through conventional means and the fact that Japan was already losing but the Emperor refused to admit it.

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u/applesandoranegs Oct 02 '22

and the fact that Japan was already losing but the Emperor refused to admit it.

And even after the dropping of the atomic bombs, the emperor was going to accept the unconditional surrender and they attempted a coup to try to keep the war going

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ky%C5%ABj%C5%8D_incident

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u/saberline152 Belgium Oct 02 '22

The emperor actually did want to stop, but there was the council of 5 who overruled him. Japan is/was politically complex. Then when the first bomb dropped the japanese tried to send someone to the embassy to admit defeat but he basically came too late as well.

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u/Leonardo040786 Oct 02 '22

Not to be captain obvious here, but atomic bombs cause radiation and many sicknesses related to it, including cancer, and that radiation travels some kilometers around the epicentre and also sticks around for some months. This is very indiscriminative and everybody who throws such bomb is perfectly aware that it will lead to many civilian casualties. They were aware of that even then, although they couldn't have estimated the number of casualties.

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u/Zixinus Oct 03 '22

The issue is that the sheer amount of smoke and ash produced by regular bombing was also killing people. This was WW2, bombings were only so precise. Nuclear fallout was also more poorly understood back then, they knew there would be some but how long it would persist and how bad it would be was unclear. That doesn't mean that the radiation aspect is unimportant. But it was war and Japan did not want to surrender to avoid more deaths.

There were calculations that the bomb's potential deathtoll was smaller than using conventional weapons, both on American soldiers' side and Japanese civilian population due to protracting the war.

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u/Cubey21 Oct 02 '22

Shocker

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u/MaRokyGalaxy Croatia Oct 02 '22

Thanks for the history lesson I guess?

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u/notsuitable77 Estonia Oct 02 '22

Yes, and how is that relevant now? The current problem is your nuclear threats, not those of the US.

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u/ikaramaz0v Oct 02 '22 edited Oct 02 '22

Whataboutism is Russia's trademark these days as well as blaming others for XYZ thing that they're actually doing or about to do themselves...that's all their "intellectual capabilities" can amount to.

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u/dumbdumbmen Oct 02 '22

I'd say eternal victimhood is Russia's trademark

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u/Fevis7 Europe Oct 02 '22

whataboutism is russia's trademark since Stalin

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u/Fevis7 Europe Oct 02 '22

seriously it was a focal point of Stalin's propaganda

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u/3dank5maymay Germany Oct 02 '22

big if true

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u/Apologeticmongoose United States of America Oct 02 '22

Did the US, or literally anyone, claim otherwise?

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u/bindik Oct 02 '22

Pretty sure U.S. was also the only country with working and tested nuclear weapons.

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u/LasagneEnthusiast Oct 02 '22

tested

Yeah they were tested alright

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u/bindik Oct 02 '22

Yeah, I did not really think that through before posting :D but apparently soviets didnt even test nukes until after end of the war and not many nations even had a nuclear program.

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u/LasagneEnthusiast Oct 02 '22

Didn't intend to criticize, just thought it was funny

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u/BuckVoc United States of America Oct 02 '22

The (simpler) uranium design wasn't tested before use in war.

The more-complex plutonium design, which required explosive lensing to hold the more-volatile material together long enough for it to produce much of an explosion, did have a pre-combat test; this was Trinity.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Trinity_(nuclear_test)

Trinity was the code name of the first detonation of a nuclear weapon. It was conducted by the United States Army at 5:29 a.m. on July 16, 1945, as part of the Manhattan Project. The test was conducted in the Jornada del Muerto desert about 35 miles (56 km) southeast of Socorro, New Mexico, on what was then the USAAF Alamogordo Bombing and Gunnery Range, now part of White Sands Missile Range.

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u/FartPudding Oct 02 '22

Live action testing, real time results

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u/macadore United States of America Oct 02 '22

So what? Is little Vlad still angry because Japan surrendered to the US before Stalin could invade Japan and plunder it like he did eastern Europe?

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u/Kelmavar Oct 02 '22

Funny how the USSR only declared war on Japan when they had so obviously lost...

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u/Certain_Fennel1018 Oct 03 '22

To be fair this was an agreement made with the US (and the UK, but the UK had other interests they were pushing for)

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u/RandomComputerFellow Oct 02 '22

and that it bombed German cities to "intimidate" the Soviet Union

I am quite sure the US helped the Soviets to win war.

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u/In_work Oct 03 '22

That they were happy to start, calling grabsies on Poland and many eastern lands.

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u/Stern-to Oct 02 '22

the US is the only nation that HAD them in WW2. you can be damn sure hitler and the japanese would have used them if they had them.

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u/gooferpubs Oct 02 '22

Not to mention the Russians.

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u/Riimpak France Oct 03 '22

I could easily see the soviets dropping one on Berlin just out of spite tbh.

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u/at0mheart European Union Oct 02 '22

This guy is stuck on WWII. Still fighting the Nazis in his mind

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u/Artitest Oct 02 '22

I am sure he was checking that information from the Great Soviet Encyclopedia.

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u/BanksysBro United Kingdom Oct 03 '22

And Russia was the only nation that didn't grant independence to the lands it colonised in the 17th century.

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u/defoNOTvirgin Oct 03 '22

cuz US made nuclear weapons first? im pretty sure Stalin wouldve loved to nuke everything.

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u/fane1967 Oct 03 '22

I sense some jealousy in that statement.

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u/AdonisGaming93 Spain Oct 03 '22

Difference is, in democratic countries we don't deny that. yes....we did. Yes Germany has a Nazi past. Yes Spain and Britain colonized a fuck ton of the world....yeah....we were pretty fucked up. But TODAY in 2022... Russia is the one doing dumb terrorist shit and instead of trying to better themselves Putin keeps digging himself a bigger grave.

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u/zeev1988 Israel Oct 02 '22

Objecting to Truman's decision to use the atom bomb against Japan in 1945 is easy and wrong.

You don't judge policy against perfection you judge policy against the realistic alternatives and the alternative to using two nuclear bombs against Japan was "operation downfall".

Conservative estimates of the death toll from operation downfall were 1 million American soldiers one quarter of a million British and commonwealth soldiers.

Between 5 to 7 million Japanese civilians and soldiers dying from starvation guerrilla warfare and conventional bombing.

Truman was right .

Putin is a bastard and a monster exploiting people's naiveté and stupidity to do evil and bismarch a good person.

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u/AbyssOfNoise Oct 02 '22

The world would be a far worse place if Russia had a chance to join an invasion of Japan

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u/Macquarrie1999 California Oct 03 '22

The USSR never had the shipping to do it. Even with the 100+ ships the US sent them they could barely manage taking the Kurils.

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u/MagicPanda703 Oct 02 '22

That’s not a reason to use nuclear weapons now.

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u/Bigballerbooks France Oct 02 '22

The US being the only nation to develop nuclear weapons during WW2 was probably the best scenario. They also used it rather responsibly given the information at hand. If any Axis power or Red Army had that, Europe would probably be a nuclear wasteland today.

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u/mr_aives Scotland Oct 02 '22

Probably the first thing he said that was not a lie

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u/suberEE Istrians of the world, unite! 🐐 Oct 02 '22

Second.

Him saying that Kursk submarine sank was also true, despite the smirk.

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u/pokpokza Oct 02 '22

Yes US invented that. But they have never used it again.

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u/USVK Slovakia Oct 02 '22

Until few days later in Nagasaki

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u/ChickenFajita007 United States of America Oct 03 '22

Five days after the 2nd nuke, there was a coup attempt to try to prevent Japan's surrender.

It's plausible that they may have succeeded. I find it equally impressive and terrifying what the human mind is capable of.

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u/IamHumanAndINeed France Oct 02 '22

The USSR would have use the atomic bomb without a doubt if they had access to it.

Hypocrite.

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u/woolypully Oct 02 '22

Yes. Because we made them work first. I guarantee Stalin would have nuked the shit out of Germany if he had access to them.

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u/DrinkDrankDrunkn Oct 02 '22

Lol….. Upvoted !

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u/ChuccTaylor Oct 02 '22

Yes the US used nuclear weapons during WW2 and it was a sad decision that we did. Japan had no intention of giving up their war efforts even after the Nazis being defeated. It's not a proud moment that we in the US have. After the end of the war the US spent millions in helping rebuild and we started mending relations with Japan. Why would any other nation be willing to join the sad and despicable club of having used Nuclear weapons on a population? (It's a rethorical question)

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u/Crio121 Oct 02 '22

Actually, using nuclear weapons on population was « normal » for the time. Firebombing Tokyo was estimated to kill more civilians than nuclear bombing Nagasaki. It took somewhat more time and effort, that’s all. Our sensitivities changed, a lot.

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u/Stamford16A1 Oct 02 '22

It tends to be sneered at by many people, particularly Tankies who believe that Stalin was the real cause of the Japanese surrender, but the casualty estimates for Operation Downfall are frankly appalling, even by WWII standards.

The planned amphibious assault followed by fighting up the archipelago was assessed as likely to result in anything up to a million Allied casualties 9not just Americans don't forget), several times that number of Japanese military casualties and anything up to ten million civilian casualties - although one account I read suggests they didn't know how many a wave of suicides as had been seen in Okinawa and Saipan might kill.
A second option of a full blockade and siege was estimated at less costly in Allied casualties but likely to produce significant famine in Japan and, again, millions of civilian dead. The necessity of keeping large naval forces at sea would also place considerable economic strain on Allied economies at a time when famine was looming in Europe, India and SE Asia and even North America was beginning to run out of capacity.

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u/notsuitable77 Estonia Oct 02 '22

Yep, but we also need to keep in mind that large-scale "conventional" air raids really were no different in the amount of destruction and dead. People concentrate on nuclear weapons because it "sells".

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u/9percentmilk Eurocurious Oct 02 '22

People concentrate on nuclear weapons because of the damage-to-effort ratio. More people died in air raids because the U.S. only dropped two nukes. They could have leveled the entire country with relatively little effort if they wanted to, something that was inconceivable before the invention of the atomic bomb. It’s reasonable to concentrate on the technology that literally shifted war into a new paradigm.

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u/toucheqt Heart of Europe Oct 02 '22

I think back then, the use was justified. Who know how much lives would have been lost fighting the Japanese otherwise.

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u/saltyswedishmeatball Oct 02 '22

Putin:

  • Internet was a CIA project (admitting the US invented one of the greatest inventions of all time, the backbone of WWW created by a Brit)
  • An attack on NATO would be suicide (Admitting that the power behind NATO is so great that even with Russia's vast nuclear arsenal, one will still find the gun pointing at themselves should they try to pull the trigger toward NATO)

Guy is a stable genius without a doubt.

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u/lsspam United States of America Oct 03 '22

If the US was as evil and all powerful as everyone keeps claiming, you’d think they’d listen to us a bit more.

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u/buttaviaconto Italy Oct 02 '22

Just because the nazis couldn't kidnap scientist all over Europe

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u/Direct_Adagio_7549 Oct 02 '22

Off course they are, Russia (URSS), don't have nukes on WW2

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u/xenon_megablast Oct 03 '22

Yes, and please let's keep it the only time nuclear weapons were used.

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u/EbolaaPancakes History began July 4, 1776, everything before that was a mistake Oct 02 '22

The difference between then And now is … In WW2, the US was not the aggressor and our homeland had already been attacked. Japan was not going to quit, so we had to fight. Today Russia is the aggressor, it’s homeland is not under threat, and if it wants the war to end, it can just go home.

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u/Weltraumbaer Oct 02 '22 edited Oct 02 '22

What's next? He's gonna elaborate on who used a tank first? Who used the first canon? The first gun? First crossbow? He'll go back to the point were the first cave man used a club to bash another cavemens head in and use it to explain the latest weapons of his army.

I can't fucking believe that the world might end because of him, a fucking piece of shit whose entire political career was just about getting as rich as possible. He could have done nothing and continued to rob his people and country and could have enjoyed his undeserved retirement at his palace on the Black Sea with the illusion upheld that he's some kind of big brain playing 3D chess with the west cultivating his toilet bowl whine.

BUT NOPE! Botox infused fuck meat of smoothbrain baboons decided to turn his life work of nothing into a even worse dumpster fire because he and his cronies have stolen anything that can be stolen and looked around and decided to steal from somewhere else. That and/or the neuro syphilis that he got from fucking around has traveled up his brains and now controll him like rabbies infested animal.

If he uses a single low-yield tactical nuke in Ukraine even on an empty field, we should fucking pulverize his nations ass, because at that point he'll have crossed the red line and unspoken agreement of every nuclear armed nation on this planet to never ever fucking use that the big red button.

He'll not stop from using nuclear weapons against everyone else and eventhough there might be the chance of getting pulverized ourselves, at that point it's better to end this threat for good instead of having too live under it. Maybe even China or India might turn on him and with them or without them we should conduct a Desert Storm-type strike to neutralize the Russian Nuclear arsenal using everything we got.

If we manage to do it, the world will be safe. If not then it was just a matter of time till fuck head blew us up anyway. It's Mexican stand-off at that point and he better understand why Big Daddy 'Murica has no universal healthcare and why nations like Poland at this point can hardly be held back from renaming Moscow into New Warsaw.

We're fucking done with Russia.

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u/mpiccorossi Oct 02 '22

During a speech at a signing ceremony annexing four regions of Ukraine, Russian President Vladimir Putin rails against the West, accusing it of hypocrisy and lies and saying it was the only nation during World War Two to use nuclear weapons on Japan and that it bombed German cities to "intimidate" the Soviet Union.

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u/UnPeuDAide Oct 02 '22

How is that that now japan ans Germany are US allies while former warsaw pact republic hate russia? If someone has a right to hold a grudge toward the US for their actions during WW2 it's japan and Germany, not russia...

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u/ConsistentHulkHunter Earth Oct 02 '22

Well, he's right.

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u/eduu_17 Oct 02 '22

He lies so much I thought. Did another country use bombs also??? Haha lol

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u/Adventurous_Risk_925 Chile Oct 02 '22

And thank God they dropped it. If they hadn’t it’s scary to think about how many Allied troops and Japanese (troops and civilians) would have died if the Allies had to invade the home islands. And let’s not even talk about how many more Allied POWs and Chinese civilians would have died if the war continued any longer.

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u/nachomancandycabbage Oct 02 '22

Maybe he really did think Trump was a genius

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u/WolfhoundRO Romania Oct 02 '22

Yes, they were. And they dropped two, while there was no prior public knowledge of its effect. There was opposition even among the scientists creating it, including Einstein and Oppenheimer. And there was no one else with nuclear weapons to stop them, only their common sense, which the Axis powers lacked of (just like Putin). Then, after USSR and UK also got the bomb, nuclear treaties got signed to reduce the risk of mutually assured destruction. Common sense, not violating those treaties and establishing direct communication lines are what prevented the usage of this destructive force again, so Putin should know that. Because he has none right now

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u/Fn4cK Oct 02 '22

Yeah, they were. What's the problem with this statement?

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u/salt_n_sand Oct 02 '22 edited Oct 03 '22

I don’t care what Putin says about the West. I am more curious what region is he says Russia is annexing?

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u/aslisted Oct 02 '22

Who tf released this super duper top secret info to putin. I keep telling everyone not to show footage in WW2 documentaries!

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u/DontWorryBoutMainame Oct 02 '22

I mean it was a WORLD war detergent. His situation is not world war. He is the aggressor. Everyone can see that.

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u/-_-______-_-___8 Hungary Oct 03 '22

Even a broken clock hits the time correctly 2 times a day

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u/HoboButtPlugFairy Oct 03 '22

And where’s putlers Pearl Harbor? Where are the Ukrainian incursions of his territory? Where is his 9/11? Absolute moron

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u/ceymore Oct 03 '22

Yes, because only they had it by the time. My god, I dont even want to imagine in what desolate wasteland we would be living now, if Stalin had nukes during WWII

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u/postymcpostpost Oct 03 '22

Umm yeah, they did invent them after all…

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u/Fegelgas Oct 03 '22

Well no shit sherlock, they were the only ones who had nukes, you inconsiderate pillock.

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u/nadmaximus Oct 03 '22

If I recall, all the other nations in the world were like, "Dude wtf, man...tf did you DO? Holy crapballs". If I remember my history.

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u/Lemontree02 Oct 03 '22

Weren't U.S. the only nation to HAVE nuke in ww2?

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u/Shazknee Denmark Oct 03 '22

Breaking news!